Thread: Seeking a depression diagnosis

But at the same time, anti-depressants obviously have positive effects (or else no one would prescribe them).

I was on combination of anti-depressants and mood stabilizers for years. My personality did change, but for the better. There were a few times I stopped taking my medicine in those years and every time I did, I did something completely retarded.

While cognitive therapy alone might be preferable, you shouldn't feel ashamed or scared if you need to start taking anti-depressants.

(btw Gwahir, I was anon in this thread earlier.)

Originally Posted by coqauvin

unless there is something solely physiological that has damaged the neural pathways in your brain, things like cognitive therapy will achieve the same results without all the damaging side-effects and addiction to deal with afterwards.

This. Its better to get to the root of the problem with cognitive therapy rather than to just mask the real problem with medication.

Originally Posted by KT.

I think it's obvious why he wouldn't want to take drugs: negative side effects.

Well, if a drug had no negative effects, everyone would want it.

Originally Posted by coqauvin

My understanding is that anti-depressants are like using a hammer to fix a clock. Generally speaking, unless there is something solely physiological that has damaged the neural pathways in your brain, things like cognitive therapy will achieve the same results without all the damaging side-effects and addiction to deal with afterwards.

Not necessarily true, but, sort of. It's more like... trying to win at darts by throwing live bees. Eventually you'll get it, but it'll take some luck and a lot of trial and error, and the bees will act unpredictably in the meantime.

I'm not AGAINST medication. I just don't want it for me. But, if I'm told it's what I should have, I'll definitely consider it.

OK, a summary of why I'm very hesitant to take drugs:

a) the time it would take to get the cocktail right and the emotional crap I'd go through in the meantime (my dad's been clinically depressed for 20+ years and medicated for 10, and still complications crop up about his meds; although in his case his doctor thinks his condition has changed in the last few years)
b) the loss of control over my emotions -- I know that seems weird to say, given how little I have now, but at least right now my emotions are tied in to how my life is. They're uncontrolled, but predictable.
c) the difficulty of eventually getting off them -- everyone (should) know that going cold turkey off psych meds is CATASTROPHIC (many, many people, who otherwise would not, commit suicide in the withdrawl period because of just how badly it will fuck with you) and no process of weaning off is perfect.
d) potential zombification. right now I don't have much creative impulse or work ethic, but at least I have the ability to make stuff. I'm working on this show and it's going well. I don't want to alter the chemical state of my brain and do anything that could compromise that. Right now, it's all I got.

End.

Originally Posted by ozzy

This. Its better to get to the root of the problem with cognitive therapy rather than to just mask the real problem with medication.

Well, this is a dangerous statement too, because you could be "masking" a problem with counselling if there is a fundamental chemical imbalance in your brain. You could get to a point where either you've had no improvement and your counsellor is out of ideas, or where it seems that you're okay, till one day you're setting up some dominoes out of boredom and a breeze blows them down when you're half way through and you charge outside into oncoming traffic.

That's a completely made up example, but you get my point.

The drugs vs. counselling dichotomy is not easily summed up and often misrepresented; as sycld said, usually it's a mixture of both.

i am curious also

So the psychiatrist my GP referred me to is good -- clever, very observant, has a sense of humour -- but costs $300 a session (of which I get back $150 from Medicare). Jesus. He's also really quite busy, and rather in-demand. I would like to see him once a week, at least for a little while, but his cost + lack of availability makes that hard.

There are cheaper guys out there, definitely. But shopping around is awful, and every first session with a new one is essentially useless to me because we'd just be rehashing things I've gone over with others or the purposes of evaluation.

In other news, I'm finding myself less completely mental. I am still only half-functioning, and every time I think of my ex (which is all the time) I'm in pain, but at least I no longer feel like the thing to do would be to find some train tracks and lie down on them.

As often.

Just get some Buspar, jeez

Originally Posted by gwahir

So the psychiatrist my GP referred me to is good -- clever, very observant, has a sense of humour -- but costs $300 a session (of which I get back $150 from Medicare). Jesus. He's also really quite busy, and rather in-demand. I would like to see him once a week, at least for a little while, but his cost + lack of availability makes that hard.

There are cheaper guys out there, definitely. But shopping around is awful, and every first session with a new one is essentially useless to me because we'd just be rehashing things I've gone over with others or the purposes of evaluation.

In other news, I'm finding myself less completely mental. I am still only half-functioning, and every time I think of my ex (which is all the time) I'm in pain, but at least I no longer feel like the thing to do would be to find some train tracks and lie down on them.

As often.

That's great that you are making progress. If you like your current psychiatrist, I think you should stick with him (assuming you can afford it). I've seen a few different psychiatrists (multiple visits per psych), and the right person can make all the difference. I think this would be especially true for you since you are hesitant to take medication.

Good luck.

So, I figured why not give you guys an update?

Still seeing my guy once a week. Thankfully, the sessions are now A LOT cheaper, which is a plus -- if nothing else, at least now I don't spend the whole session going "this better be worth $300, this better be worth $300..." and so it's a bit freer.

However I feel, more and more, like my doctor is nothing more than the boy with his finger in the dyke. Sometimes it seems like he's shining a light on every neurosis I have, one by one, and bringing me closer to being at peace with myself, but the sheer volume of my psychological baggage -- which I didn't even know I had until about two months ago -- is overwhelming. I can't adequately express how much I hate the inside of my own head. I feel like I will never be able to function as a person.

The doc thinks I'm not "ill"; that is, he doesn't think I have a chemical imbalance or a bipolarity or anything which would require medication (though there are meds that could function as "painkillers", essentially). I agree with him. But the fact is, I'm really fucking depressed, and the fact of it not being the fault of silly chemicals just reinforces how shit-fucked I am upstairs and, since there's no cure for "sad", makes me feel like I'm never, ever going to be "happy", outside of a few fleeting, trivial moments.

Sure, I think sometimes, maybe I'm just still flapping about in breakup land. But the fact remains that I'm terrible at relationships (romantic and platonic) and don't consider myself an interesting/talented/attractive/likeable/worthwhile person. That's been the way for years. It's not breakup land. It's life.

And I just don't want to be here.

/angsty vent

just curious:

why doesn't he think you have a chemical imbalance? I mean how would a doctor even know that without doing some sort of test?

(edit: does he think you have situational depression?)

Originally Posted by KT.

just curious:

why doesn't he think you have a chemical imbalance? I mean how would a doctor even know that without doing some sort of test?

(edit: does he think you have situational depression?)

Yes, in essence. The periodicity of my depressive moods, and the fact that they are precipitated by and connected to actual events and feelings suggest it's not chemical or biological depression. If it was, I'd feel depressed sometimes even when things are good, which, in general, I'm not.

Originally Posted by simonj

I'm not going to read any further because this one paragraph out of context is amazing.

Heh.

Do you have any problems sleeping at night due to worrying or other types of thoughts racing through your brain?
Get a prescription for Trazodone, it won't screw you up like many anti-depressants and you'll sleep like a rock (I've had some pretty vivid dreams on it, but no nightmares personally which is a listed possible side effect).
25-50mg would be a regular dose for use as a sleep aid, if you used it more for general depression you might take 150mg spread throughout the day.

It's prescribed usually for mild depression and/or problems sleeping, however I've used it occasionally for off-label reasons. Mild but effective stuff.

A sleep dose would be easycakes to quit cold turkey if you ever wanted, I dunno about the larger depression doses, those may require a more gradual withdrawal. I'm not a fan of medication to solve problems either.



Thought probably impossible, to be "new-agey", if you could find a doc that uses it (unlikely) I think you'd be a perfect candidate for MDMA therapy sessions.

The only problem with my sleep is that even when I get a solid 10 hour block of it I feel like I haven't had enough.

I get plenty of sleep. But I'm always exhausted.

Which is, unsurprisingly, another symptom of depression.

Also worth mentioning:

Originally Posted by gwahir

The periodicity of my depressive moods, and the fact that they are precipitated by and connected to actual events and feelings suggest it's not chemical or biological depression.

This is why I have gone untreated for so, so long. Until very recently, my perception was "it's only depression if it's chemical, and you don't go and get treated just because you are sad". Then my friend committed suicide.

Originally Posted by sycld

Like I said, "chemical and biological" depression vs. "normal" depression are really just the same thing.


As far as I'm aware, the only real difference is that one is precipitated by events that are expected to do it, goes away after a reasonable period of time, and isn't so severe that the person, oh say, considers violence against themselves.

Severity doesn't come into the difference. You can have very mild chemical depression, or incredibly severe psychological depression.

The difference is that you can't really manage chemical depression without medication. I mean there are coping mechanisms, and you can learn to live with it, but you can't do anything to stop spontaneous depressive periods. Psychological depression, as you say, is caused by stuff. I mean you can still wake up one day depressed, where you were fine the day before, but it'll be attached to stuff going on in your head -- your baggage, basically.

The difference to me is that I feel like a shmuck for having such a bird's nest of psychic issues and coming so undone over, essentially, a break-up. At least I can feel like, someday, the mess can all be mopped up, and I'll learn to porter my own baggage -- even if I don't know how that'll ever happen.

Originally Posted by gina

Dike.

I had to double-take at this initial sentence.

Nope, both spellings are correct.

Anyway, the psych I'm seeing hasn't made much of a big deal about chemical/biological/psychological/whatever. It's just how he categorises things. He said in our first session that he agreed drugs weren't the way to go with me, and what we're doing now is psychotherapy. He's very good, so I don't have any desire to shop around.

I agree with you, basically. Heh.

Originally Posted by gina

Like you, I'm opposed to drugs. I won't even take an aspirin if I can help it.

I love how everyone says this with some ridiculous sense of accomplishment. Here's a tip, nitwits; 99.9999999999999% of the drugs out there are just copying or modifying what your body is already doing.

his is why I have gone untreated for so, so long. Until very recently, my perception was "it's only depression if it's chemical, and you don't go and get treated just because you are sad". Then my friend committed suicide.

You're not sick, you faggot; you're just learning that life is hard sometimes.
Holy shit, you people. No wonder everything is horrible


Peace, I'm out!

sweet thanks bro

did he just leave?

hey guys we finally did it!

dear santa: what i'd really like this year is to have enough security not to worry that my friends were going to hang themselves drive themselves off cliffs every time they post a despondent facebook status. (note: this worry also applies to me but hey if you wanted to do anything about that as well it'd just be gravy)

love

jem

aw thanks faesce i just saw this and i think christmas came early for ol' gwahir this year