Terminator Salvation (2009)

**Noir** · 03-22-2009, 06:52 PM

Surpised there wasn't a thread in this EA forum already about the film. What are your thoughts on the movie?

I think it looks very promising, certainly better than that awful T3. Christian Bale looks like he can play a decent John Connor, although I had really hoped they would recast Edward Furlong to maintain his resemblance and the connection to T2.

As far as the new generation of Terminators....well. The motorcycle robots are a bit out there, but not too extreme. The giant terminator is a little bit much. My biggest issue is with the T-600 terminators. Back in T1 Kyle Reese mentioned that the T-600s (the predecessors to the T-800 in the first Terminator movie) were easy to spot because they had rubber skin that looked fake, and that this latest model (the T-800) had living tissue over a mechanical endoskeleton, making them virtual impossible to distinguish from a human.

And now, three movies later we see the T-600 at last. But wait, it's eight feet tall! What the hell is up with that? Why bother clothing a terminator in rubber skin if you're going to make it taller than virtually all basketball players? There's a terminator wiki site that says that the rubber skin allows the T-600 to disguise itself at large distances, since it is difficult to judge size from far away. Really? Are you serious?

**Nick2.1** · 03-25-2009, 11:56 PM

John Connor is supposed to be a leader among men, not a bitch among people. Which is why Furlong would never be cast for this movie, don't get me wrong I like Furlong in T2 when he was a little kid, but he was a little bitchy. Bale is pretty well known for being a bad ass and that's exactly who John Connor needs to be. The movie looks amazing though.

Also...You do know that the future has been altered by past events(T1,T2, I don't think so much on T3) right? I believe it's said that this isn't the future John Connor was trained for.

**Syme** · 03-26-2009, 12:03 PM

Pretty sure there's a damn good reason they didn't use Edward Furlong again:

http://img178.imageshack.us/img178/2946/furlongmd4.jpg

The guy's not exactly "adult John Connor" material these days.

**coqauvin** · 03-26-2009, 12:05 PM

he still has the facial structure to pull it off, if he'd work out for a while.

or explore the idea of john connor being fat, depressed and bitter

**Syme** · 03-26-2009, 06:50 PM

Originally Posted by coqauvin

he still has the facial structure to pull it off, if he'd work out for a while.

My earnest opinion is that he'd still look like a twat no matter how much weight he lost; his obnoxious smirking face was okay for when John Connor was supposed to be a delinquent kid, but I don't think he could ever look like the hardass resistance leader that John Connor is supposed be in the post-nuclear future. I mean just look at this damn guy:

http://img2.timeinc.net/people/i/200...d_furlong2.jpg

He doesn't have it.

**ChedWick** · 03-26-2009, 09:19 PM

Originally Posted by coqauvin

he still has the facial structure to pull it off, if he'd work out for a while.

or explore the idea of john connor being fat, depressed and bitter

I actually see a fair resemblance between Furlong and Bale, especially in the nose; More so than Furlong and Nick Stahl ever had.

As far as fat, depressed and bitter goes.... I'm sure with robots rampaging everywhere, destroying everything food is probably pretty scarce. So you can count being fat out. Bitter could work and is probably already going to be an aspect of Conner's personality. Depressed? There's no way an emo can save man kind.

I have high hopes for this movie. I just hope it doesn't let down like rise of the machine did.

**Noir** · 03-28-2009, 02:30 AM

Wow he really let himself go...

It's been forever and a day since I saw T3, but how was it again that Cyberdyne Systems was able to start the beginnings of the Terminator program (despite Sarah and John Connor destroying the microchips and the mechanical arm in T2)?

**Syme** · 03-28-2009, 10:17 AM

Originally Posted by Noir

Wow he really let himself go...

It's been forever and a day since I saw T3, but how was it again that Cyberdyne Systems was able to start the beginnings of the Terminator program (despite Sarah and John Connor destroying the microchips and the mechanical arm in T2)?

I think that Skynet's development was delayed, rather than completely prevented, by the destruction of the arm and chip; didn't they say in T1/T2 that Skynet's nuclear war would happen in the 1990s, but then in T3 we saw that it didn't happen until the 2000s? I assume that's because it took longer to develop Skynet when they couldn't reverse-engineer from the chip.

**ChedWick** · 03-28-2009, 12:33 PM

The development of skynet was in fact delayed. The guy who Sarah Connor went to kill said the chip gave them ideas and sent them in directions that they never would have thought of. It's certainly not unrealistic to assume that the team working on the development in the second movie continued to work on it even after the chip and arm were destroyed.

If that's not enough to convince you then you must take into consideration it all had to start somewhere. There had to be the development of skynet at one point with out the technology from the future.

**Mad Pino Rage** · 04-04-2009, 10:23 PM

Is this the fourth movie in the Terminator series? Only interested in watching it in cinema because of Bale and a raving friend. What else can this series do besides appeal to loyal fans?

**Syme** · 04-05-2009, 01:42 PM

Originally Posted by Mad Pino Rage

Is this the fourth movie in the Terminator series? Only interested in watching it in cinema because of Bale and a raving friend. What else can this series do besides appeal to loyal fans?

Congrats, you uncovered the secret behind multi-sequel sci-fi/action franchises.

**captain castle** · 04-07-2009, 05:17 PM

Originally Posted by Noir

And now, three movies later we see the T-600 at last. But wait, it's eight feet tall! What the hell is up with that? Why bother clothing a terminator in rubber skin if you're going to make it taller than virtually all basketball players? There's a terminator wiki site that says that the rubber skin allows the T-600 to disguise itself at large distances, since it is difficult to judge size from far away. Really? Are you serious?

You're an idiot. It was Skynet's arrogance and underestimation for mankind that let the initial series of infiltrators to be so easy to spot. That's what made the 800s so deadly. Also, as I recall, they included on board weaponry on the 600s so that they wouldn't have to procure any on their own. It was an oversight on Skynet's part.

**MalReynolds** · 04-13-2009, 12:19 PM

Pizza Hut contest online has movie pegged as PG-13.

Slightly worried, but I did enjoy Live Free or Die Hard, whose main fault, I would say, was turning McClane into a super-human near the end. As this is Terminator... Well, my suspension of disbelief runs a little deeper.

Plus, I liked S1 of the TV program, although since getting shifted to Friday nights, I've only been keeping up with character deaths.

**MrTroy** · 04-13-2009, 01:13 PM

What moves a movie from PG-13 to R? Excessive cursing (fuck), excessive gore, or nudity. None of which are necessary for a good movie.

**MalReynolds** · 04-13-2009, 01:24 PM

No, but extreme violence has been a staple of Terminator.

But T3 really could have been PG-13. The only really overly violent thing is the Terminatrix impaling the cop through the chest and then driving the car that way.

**coqauvin** · 04-13-2009, 02:48 PM

it's usually blood-tastic violence that moves it to R, isn't it?

Terminator isn't known for being gornography

**Absolution** · 05-20-2009, 01:18 PM

Originally Posted by Noir

Surpised there wasn't a thread in this EA forum already about the film. What are your thoughts on the movie?

I think it looks very promising, certainly better than that awful T3. Christian Bale looks like he can play a decent John Connor, although I had really hoped they would recast Edward Furlong to maintain his resemblance and the connection to T2.

As far as the new generation of Terminators....well. The motorcycle robots are a bit out there, but not too extreme. The giant terminator is a little bit much. My biggest issue is with the T-600 terminators. Back in T1 Kyle Reese mentioned that the T-600s (the predecessors to the T-800 in the first Terminator movie) were easy to spot because they had rubber skin that looked fake, and that this latest model (the T-800) had living tissue over a mechanical endoskeleton, making them virtual impossible to distinguish from a human.

And now, three movies later we see the T-600 at last. But wait, it's eight feet tall! What the hell is up with that? Why bother clothing a terminator in rubber skin if you're going to make it taller than virtually all basketball players? There's a terminator wiki site that says that the rubber skin allows the T-600 to disguise itself at large distances, since it is difficult to judge size from far away. Really? Are you serious?

ANGEL FACE!!!!!

**Vengeful Scars** · 05-20-2009, 08:52 PM

You can only say fuck once and get away with a PG-13 rating.

**jack burden** · 05-21-2009, 01:44 AM

That movie was pretty manly. I grew four extra testicles from just watching it.

yeah

**captain castle** · 05-21-2009, 08:13 AM

Awww I need to see it

**MalReynolds** · 05-25-2009, 01:27 AM

Saw it:

Verdict? Big. Loud. Soulless. But competently done. Tread no new Terminator ground, but was enjoyable, and makes me look forward to the sequels. Kind of a misuse of the franchise name - the series isn't normally associated with big, dumb, loud movies, but it was the first to take place in the future, during a war. So I expected it to be somewhat loud and mannish.

Not necessary to see it in theaters, but worth a peek. It's no T1 or T2, but it's not the ham-fisted comedy of T3, so it has that going for it. It's like the Bionic Commando game. There's a good game in there, you just have to get past some shit first. It's disappointing that some of the better aspects of the movie go unexplored completely, but from what I hear, McG is a really nice guy who pretty much did this one as fan service in order to please the exceptionally hard to please Terminator fanbase. I hope he does more, because if T5-6 are like T4, I'll be bored half-way through T5. I don't want something incredibly cerebral, but a little more thought/heart couldn't hurt.

**jack burden** · 05-26-2009, 03:40 AM

Originally Posted by MalReynolds

Saw it:

Verdict? Big. Loud. Soulless. But competently done. Tread no new Terminator ground, but was enjoyable, and makes me look forward to the sequels. Kind of a misuse of the franchise name - the series isn't normally associated with big, dumb, loud movies, but it was the first to take place in the future, during a war. So I expected it to be somewhat loud and mannish.

Not necessary to see it in theaters, but worth a peek. It's no T1 or T2, but it's not the ham-fisted comedy of T3, so it has that going for it. It's like the Bionic Commando game. There's a good game in there, you just have to get past some shit first. It's disappointing that some of the better aspects of the movie go unexplored completely, but from what I hear, McG is a really nice guy who pretty much did this one as fan service in order to please the exceptionally hard to please Terminator fanbase. I hope he does more, because if T5-6 are like T4, I'll be bored half-way through T5. I don't want something incredibly cerebral, but a little more thought/heart couldn't hurt.

Wait...Terminator has always been dumb. It's not like it is some classic series renowned for its storytelling.

**MalReynolds** · 05-26-2009, 07:24 AM

Originally Posted by jack burden

Wait...Terminator has always been dumb. It's not like it is some classic series renowned for its storytelling.

It was renowned until T3 came out. The first 2 are good films. T3 and T4 are good movies.

T3 stopped exploring the idea of fate and destiny, and how the future is always changing, and gave us - the future is set like this, deal with it. Forget the message of T1, T2, just trust us on this one. John Connor never had those general's that the T-X came back to kill, because she always killed them, and this always happened, so you never really had any generals.

T4 FLOPS THIS and says no fate but what we make it. Which is weird, because I viewed T4 as a prequel to T1, meaning, Kyle Reese was always kidnapped, Marcus always escaped custody, John always broke into that facility, etc.

And the Terminator franchise has never just been known as, "That big, dumb action movie."

**MalReynolds** · 05-26-2009, 11:04 AM

Original plot of Terminator: Salvation

Imagine this:

We never see John Connor. At least, until the very end of the movie. You see, he's reclusive - the many, many attempts on his life by robits from the future have taken a psychological toll, so he lives on a submarine, a ghost leader of the resistance, urging all others to fight the good fight, and he's damned effective.

Marcus still appears, like so, coming out of the mud. But instead of getting picked up at the gas station, he and Kyle Reese fight some cannibals together. It's pretty slick - and Marcus teaches Kyle to drive. The focus of the film is on their relationship, like T-800 was to a young John. Eventually, Kyle still gets captured.

But Skynet has NO IDEA WHO THE HELL HE IS. A main complaint with the film is that Skynet hatches a lame attempt to kill John Connor by capturing Kyle Reese, when they could just... uh, kill Kyle as soon as they recognize him. Of course, many, many scenarios have since been created to validate why Skynet did what it did, and they make as much sense, but still.

In any case, Marcus's interactions with Blair are much more blunt. He saves her from wolves instead of rapists, and she offers him a FOTS - Fuck on the Spot. Which he declines.

When he is captured by the resistance, he is interrogated by John Connor - via radio, as John Connor is under the impression that Marcus is from even further in the future.

In any case, he escapes, and makes his way to save Reese - a child he has bonded with - and Star, that stupid fucking mute girl.

When he reaches Skynet LA, he finds something shocking.

A beach-side paradise. No joke. Skynet is taking humans and converting them into Cyborgs, giving them a life without pain or suffering. See, Skynet before Judgment day crunched the numbers and found that humanity was going to off itself in about 200 years, so it took proactive measures, killing the majority of the population and saving the others in order to give them a pain free life. Serena - played by Helena Bonham Carter - explains all this to Marcus. There's a neural net, a composite of shared memories processed by removing the brain and uploading it to a network, the step taken before one becomes a full cyborg. And then she gives Marcus the bad news - Star has already been terminated, and Reese has already had his brain removed.

Serena is distracted by an explosion, and Marcus jumps through a temporal field - Project ANGEL, what Serena was working on, also dabbled in time travel. Marcus goes back in time about 20 minutes, causes the explosion to distract her, and rescues Reese and star. A large ATV chase, with Reese at the wheel, ensues through the beach paradise, where they are chased by HK tanks and choppers.

They finally reach the marina, where a sub and thousands of Resistance fighters, surface, and fight the machines off. Connor steps off the sub, when Marcus notices among the crowd of survivors, Serena is watching. She blows off Marcus's arm, and shoots Connor in the gut.

The resistance, not knowing what the hell Connor looks like, doesn't really flinch, and they cart both Marcus and Connor off. Kate and Connor know he is going to die, and offer Marcus a choice - he can live as a cyborg, or as the new leader of the resistance, with John Connor's face grafted on. He elects to lead the resistance.

See, I find it much more interesting, as the title "SALVATION" makes more sense - as in, the salvation of humanity through Serena and Project Angel - rather than what we got.

Hearing the original plot makes me somewhat frustrated, because it sounds pretty fucking cool, but I was still pleasantly surprised with T4. Just kind of, confused, because I know why they scrapped the plot. John Connor wasn't in it. McG approached Bale to play Marcus, and Bale wanted to play Connor. And the only way to get Bale to sign, was to give Connor a bigger part. And the only way to give Connor a bigger part, was to give him something to do. And the only way to give him something to do, was to sacrifice the endgame. The first 2/3 of the movie plays out about the same - Connor, making radio calls, just doing whatever - which is why if you removed the Connor scenes from the first 2/3 of the movie, the film would have the exact same story. The clusterfuck of the third act is a huge bummer because while it looked cool, it didn't make a damn lick of sense, and I would have much rather seen the original ending. Hell, it even makes more sense, Connor's fate, after giving him more to do in the movie - get us invested in the character. It seemed like they were setting everything up to be knocked down, but then they copped out at the ending, and nothing has changed.

Which gives credence to my half baked theory:

That Skynet is doing everything it can to ensure the events in the first 3 Terminator movies do happen. And after they have ensured that the future cannot be meddled with by anything in the past, they make their movies.

**jack burden** · 05-26-2009, 02:06 PM

But then what would they do with Michael Ironside? He is just so awesome.

**MalReynolds** · 05-26-2009, 02:33 PM

He is. But waaaayyyy underused in T:S.

... I dunno, have him play Connor or something, in the original script he only shows up for about 2 minutes and no one knows who he is.

**Infernus** · 05-26-2009, 02:38 PM

I thought it was a good action film, Terminator never really makes sense anyways, to me at least.

Also I thought the actor that played Marcus took the movie he was great.

**Mr. E** · 05-29-2009, 11:13 AM

I thought it was awful. The acting was awful. The story was awful. Sure, it was big, loud, and explodey, but I require more than just those thins to enjoy a movie. This movie was shallow even in its depth and had no soul whatsoever.

**SneeBeezums** · 05-30-2009, 08:14 PM

It was a fun film but I had to laugh when I first heard Christane Bale talk. He still seemed to have his laughable Batman voice.

In any case, T:S is no where near as good as the first two films. I have a feeling they're just gonna run the series into the ground because they set this up for more sequals.